New Proposed Stat: Win Or Quality Start

Although it’s not quite an age-old debate, we in the fantasy baseball community like to argue the relative merits of using the win or quality start (henceforth QS) for measuring pitcher performance. Obviously, in a general baseball sense, we mostly agree that neither stat is important. However, for fantasy purposes, a count of good starts does seem a useful category. And we only have two ways to do it – either use wins or QS. I’m here to propose a third alternative.

For the record, if forced to pick a side in a straight battle, I’ll choose wins every time. I really don’t view QS as a viable fantasy category except in the shallowest of leagues. They’re exceptionally predictable – mostly because the supply of pitchers who regularly finish the sixth inning is tiny. Proponents of the QS call that a feature. I think it’s a bug. The pool of pitchers who can supply a rosterable total of QS is typically between 40 and 50 players – depending on how you define “rosterable.” Our friends (competitors?) at Baseball Prospectus found that the QS is dying.

From a narrow view, wins are even harder to buy in bulk. More pitchers reach 10 QS than 10 wins. If you consider both stats on a rate basis – that is QS/IP and W/IP – that calculus changes dramatically. There are still just a few dozen pitchers who earn QS in bulk. Some of them are guys like Jordan Zimmermann – i.e. unrosterable for other reasons. When shiny prospects receive their call up, they aren’t very likely to pitch six innings. They do have a shot at a win.

Additionally, wins do not deprive relievers of a category. This has massive implications for player value, and it leaves open a wide range of strategic options for roster management. Since most non-elite starters and quality relievers win games at roughly the same rate by W/IP, owners can literally turn to a pool of hundreds to address their needs. This is especially important in head-to-head formats. We know there will always be 2,430 wins in a season (less rainouts).

An Alternative

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Enemies of the win point to the fickle nature of the stat. A pitcher could cough up seven runs in five innings and record the victory. Relievers vulture wins all the time – that is, they give up the lead and then their offense immediately responds in the next half inning. The worst is when a pitcher throws eight innings of one-run ball en route to a no decision. Some pitchers on bad teams (ahem, Chris Archer), frequently win fewer than 10 games despite 15 win ability. You always know the exact parameters of the QS. Offense isn’t a factor.

In the intro paragraph, I identified what we’re trying to capture – a proxy for a count of good starts. Wins don’t quite do it. Run support and reliever meltdowns scramble the calculus. QS work in theory but not in practice due to their limited supply. They also exclude relievers. QS leagues are strategically hobbled.

My proposal is to combine the stats into WorQS (rhymes with “corks”). Or if you prefer WandorQS (“wan dorks” or “wand orcs”). This is pretty simple. If a pitcher records a standard win, he earns one WorQS. If he tosses a QS, he earns one WorQS. And here’s the wrinkle – if he gets a win AND a QS, he still earns only one WorQS. The point of the stat is to eat away at some of the downsides for both stats. In the case of wins, this eliminates the need for run or reliever support. It also fixes the supply-side problem for the QS.

Are there issues? Sure. Mostly, undeserved wins will still be awarded to bad starts and vulture relievers. I don’t see that as a big problem. After all, those pitchers are still tagged with lethal rate stats for those outings.





You can follow me on twitter @BaseballATeam

29 Comments
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hegglundMember since 2025
8 years ago

Among SPs who pitched 80 innings last year, only 35 averaged 6 IP per GS. Only one (Kluber) averaged 7 IP (7.02). So, in a 15-team league, you only have 2+ SPs per team who average enough IP per start to meet the QS threshold. And when you realize that some of those in that select group are Ty Blach, Mike Leake, Clayton Richard, and R.A. Dickey…yeah, it’s ugly.

nglowaski
8 years ago

Wouldn’t the easiest solution be to change QS to QSI (Quality Started Innings)? would maintain the integrity of the category in the pitching category landscape (wouldn’t alter the valuations between SP and RP). By breaking QS down to the Inning or Out level, you can also play with bucketing/thresholds as well. Makes the category less ‘binary’.

Backdoor SliderMember since 2025
8 years ago

Why not have this new stat allow—
Win = 0.5
QS= 0.5
WandorQS= 1

This way the cheap W still holds some value, the QS still holds some value, and those elite SP on good teams rack up both.

Ariel CohenFanGraphs Staff
8 years ago

Ron Shandler once argued for W+QS as a roto stat. He showed that if you look at the standings, the top pitchers still come out as the leaders with it. Would love to see the actual 2017 WorQS leaderboard.

jikky_jeff
8 years ago
Reply to  Ariel Cohen

I’m in a 10 team NL Only auction keeper league and last year we started using the W+QS. We had too many RP’s getting cheap wins and making those good pitchers on bad teams less valuable. So adding the W+QS made more guys roster SP over loading up on RP. I love the idea of the WorQS though, and would love to use it for sure.

CubFan
8 years ago
Reply to  jikky_jeff

After 20+ years our league voted to switch to W+QS this year. Too late to switch to WorQS. So, after one year did your league like making the switch to W+QS?

jikky_jeff
8 years ago
Reply to  CubFan

Yeah, everyone was happy with it. We were all upset that our good SP wouldn’t get W’s because of the teams they were on. This really helped make up for that. We’re keeping for sure, but if the site would be able to handle it, i would gladly do the WorQS thing. The one negative is the 2 “points” for a W+QS.

whiptydojoe
8 years ago
Reply to  jikky_jeff

What site are you guys on that has W+QS as the stat or do you have it as two categories W as one and QS as another?

eldurkoMember since 2017
8 years ago
Reply to  Ariel Cohen

This probably won’t format well, but I’ll give it a go. If anyone knows of a preformatted text tag, let me know, and I can update the reply.

Rank Name G GS IP W QS WorQS
1.0 Chris Sale 32 32 214.3 17 23 25
3.5 Carlos Carrasco 32 32 200.0 18 19 24
3.5 Chris Archer 34 34 201.0 10 20 24
3.5 Corey Kluber 29 29 203.7 18 22 24
3.5 Marcus Stroman 33 33 201.0 13 20 24
7.5 Gio Gonzalez 32 32 201.0 15 22 23
7.5 Jacob deGrom 31 31 201.3 15 21 23
7.5 Justin Verlander 33 33 206.0 15 23 23
7.5 Max Scherzer 31 31 200.7 16 22 23
14.5 Carlos Martinez 32 32 205.0 12 20 22
14.5 Ervin Santana 33 33 211.3 16 20 22
14.5 Gerrit Cole 33 33 203.0 12 20 22
14.5 Julio Teheran 32 32 188.3 11 20 22
14.5 Luis Severino 31 31 193.3 14 21 22
14.5 Patrick Corbin 33 32 189.7 14 19 22
14.5 Rick Porcello 33 33 203.3 11 19 22
14.5 Stephen Strasburg 28 28 175.3 15 20 22
14.5 Zach Davies 33 33 191.3 17 15 22
14.5 Zack Greinke 32 32 202.3 17 19 22
22.5 Clayton Kershaw 27 27 175.0 18 20 21
22.5 Drew Pomeranz 32 32 173.7 17 17 21
22.5 Jeff Samardzija 32 32 207.7 9 20 21
22.5 Jon Lester 32 32 180.7 13 18 21
22.5 Tanner Roark 32 30 181.3 13 17 21
22.5 Yu Darvish 31 31 186.7 10 19 21
29.0 Alex Wood 27 25 152.3 16 15 20
29.0 Dylan Bundy 28 28 169.7 13 19 20
29.0 Ivan Nova 31 31 187.0 11 17 20
29.0 Jason Vargas 32 32 179.7 18 16 20
29.0 Lance Lynn 33 33 186.3 11 18 20
29.0 Luis Perdomo 29 29 163.7 8 16 20
29.0 Martin Perez 32 32 185.0 13 16 20
38.0 German Marquez 29 29 162.0 11 14 19
38.0 Jhoulys Chacin 32 32 180.3 13 16 19
38.0 Jimmy Nelson 29 29 175.3 12 17 19
38.0 Jose Quintana 32 32 188.7 11 18 19
38.0 Jose Urena 34 28 169.7 14 12 19
38.0 Marco Estrada 33 33 186.0 10 17 19
38.0 Michael Fulmer 25 25 164.7 10 18 19
38.0 Mike Leake 31 31 186.0 10 18 19
38.0 R.A. Dickey 31 31 190.0 10 18 19
38.0 Robbie Ray 28 28 162.0 15 16 19
38.0 Trevor Bauer 32 31 176.3 17 15 19
47.0 Aaron Nola 27 27 168.0 12 17 18
47.0 Alex Cobb 29 29 179.3 12 15 18
47.0 Andrew Cashner 28 28 166.7 11 18 18
47.0 John Lackey 31 30 170.7 12 12 18
47.0 Masahiro Tanaka 30 30 178.3 13 17 18
47.0 Sean Manaea 29 29 158.7 12 14 18
47.0 Sonny Gray 27 27 162.3 10 17 18

NL Rules
8 years ago
Reply to  eldurko

Thanks for posting this list. At a glance if you sorted the same pitchers by W+QS, some aces would rank higher, but also Vargas for example. The idea of W or QS is cool but I think W+QS is better — because I’d rather devalue cheap wins and double reward starters who both pitch well (flawed QS stat) and get a win (most leagues are stuck with this stat in some form).

eldurkoMember since 2017
8 years ago

I’m in a dynasty league that has weekly lineups, 3 SP, 2 RP, and 2 P. You must have at least 2 pitchers not making starts that week in the RP slots – no gaming the system. That’s never usually an issue though, due to the 2 P spots, and most teams run 5/2 or 4/3. QS/SV/SO/WHIP/ERA

Anyway – that was the context – I like this WorQS stat, and think in the above situation, it would be interesting to institute WorQS instead of QS, and (SV + H) instead of SV. The twist though, is that a pitcher can only qualify for one of those stats, depending on whether they’re in a SP, or RP slot.

Doubtful CBS has that ability to be that customizable though.

Nasty Nate
8 years ago

Wand Orcs!

HappyFunBallMember since 2019
8 years ago

In a related note … any chance FanGraphs starts reporting on QS this year? As an achieved stat, if not a predicted one?

Ryan BrockMember since 2025
8 years ago
Reply to  HappyFunBall

Please, this.

BleezyBones34
8 years ago

In our league we use both. Our league is 11 years old so we’ve had many changes but most recently instead of valuing the win @ 10 we’ve changed it to a 5 for QS and 5 for a win. Head to head obviously but i really like it. In regards to fantasy, aside from the elite arms, I feel they have become similar to RB in football drafts. Anyways, this has worked for us but as the years progress we’ll see how the QS holds up.

lostatlimboMember since 2017
8 years ago

I’d be in favor of it, if the Win AND QS equaled 2 points (or maybe 1.5).

The whole point of fantasy stats is to gauge how effective a player is in the context of the game and it’s undeniable that a pitcher garnering a win on 7-8 IP and less than 3 runs is definitively more valuable than the 7 runs in 5 IP variety.

omar207
8 years ago

Can someone please convince me of the utility in rewarding Relievers who vulture Wins [as WorQS & Wins do so]? The argument that it creates “strategic flexibility” is falling on my deaf ears. With that logic one might propose to just add myriad scoring categories–“hey, we’re trying to make our league ‘flexible’ for owners who are less adept at putting together winning rosters than other owners in our league.”

Wins nor WorQS actually reward owners for rostering good baseball players in the fantasy context. They both reward mediocrity. Whatever you say about the scarcity of QS, you can’t say it was awarded to a poor pitching performance.

My answer to the scarcity issue is “quit crying & be a better GM.” When HRs were down did we call for a change to HR+H cause, “hey, hits are easier to find around the league than HRs?”

To me all this does (and all Wins do) is act like some kind of “competitive balance” mechanism. Bah! Why water down a league in order to make things easier for managers who apparently can’t hack it?

At the end of the season I want to know I lost to a manager who did his homework, not one who was spoon-fed a category victory that doesn’t even correlate to real-life “good” baseball playing abilities.

Draft better. Trade better. Plan better. Scout better. Know your league better. Don’t lower the bar, raise it. If a manager is losing at FBB because they can’t find enough Wins or QS drizzled around the league, well dude, there’s always Fantasy Football.

richarnd
8 years ago
Reply to  omar207

I don’t think the point is to value vulture relievers, but rather relievers who “earn” their Ws. Think multi-inning guys like Yusmeiro Petit, or high-leverage non-closers who don’t get saves, like Betances or Andrew Miller. Their value goes up. So does the value of “vulture” relievers. But not much – as the article points out, their rate stats still probably make them unrosterable, plus its very hard to predict who will vulture a win. At worst there’s a bit of luck added, in exchange for making a much broader class of good baseball players fantasy-relevant/valuable.

AlexTheGreat
8 years ago

In a couple of my deep leagues we’ve addressed this problem by adding IP as a category. Try it out, it works great to smooth out the dropoff after the QS stop.

whiptydojoe
8 years ago
Reply to  AlexTheGreat

We added IP as a category last year, and I’m not sure I’m a fan. Our current set-up is QS, IP, K, ERA, WHIP, & Net Saves+Holds.

Would love to hear more about its merits after having only used it one season so far. FWIW–I don’t fall into either extreme of ONLY going after RP stats or ONLY going after SP stats

dskurnikMember since 2017
8 years ago

Why not “Quality Wins”? W+QS. This is something I’ve been hoping would be added for awhile. Then a W and a QS are both worth half as much, maybe a half point each, so a “Quality Win” is worth 1 full point in that category. (Didn’t see there was already a comment about this and can’t figure out how to delete the comment.)

feslenraster
8 years ago

I like both stats. To me the hold is an interesting stat due to how to determine ‘value’ of MR.